Preset manager kill me

[lesobrod]

Here is the simple example with knobs. Some of them are exactly from Toolbox,
some was edited (Decay).
1. All Default fields in Property are set to definite values.
When i switch between Programs in Preset Manager, all knobs behave as crazy.
What does Default mean then and how can i set all of them to definite for any Program?
2. In some Programs (5,6,..) Decay knobs just disappear (oo_OO).
I changed them only by adding a couple of primitives into module (for dB-like control).
I'm going crazy, please tell smth!

[Mo]

1. You need different preset names for each control. Default means the value the knob will reset to when ctrl + click.
2. The knob can disappear when it set to a value that not in range of the knob. To fix, just adjust the knob and the right value would be stored.

[lesobrod]

I set different names. But i don't understand anyway, fron where come values for empty program?
Thanx, I see why knob disappear, but why it has meaningless value?

[Mo]

Empty means 0 and if your knob got range -3 to -1 the knob will disappear as 0 is out of the range.

[lesobrod]

Something is still very weird. It seems that knobs set to random values from one empty program to another.

And about names.. I've got 7 or more identical modules(harmonics) with over 9 controls per each.
Is there non-masochistic way to set names like "Volume-1", "Link-7" etc., so automate naming?

[Mo]

Could be build in preset in the preset manager, but when you adjust each knob for all presets, it would work.

automate naming?

Not really. You can link the preset names together, then add 1 to the preset name for each knob.

[lesobrod]

From Wiki:
a digression
If this strikes you as a lot of grunt work, it is. For a really complex synth with multiple layers and dozens of repeated elements it would be too much maintenance. There is a way, however, to have component presets inherit names from their parent module and the stock modules and controls have this mechanism built in. But using it requires you to enter ‘Developer Mode’ and start dealing with the underlying event mechanism instead of simply connecting blocks of high-level components as we have done so far in these tutorials. A more advanced tutorial on the preset manager should be available in the not-too-distant future.

Oh I need this tutorial!!

[trogluddite]

You can see the principle in the stock knobs.
Inside the preset part you'll find a wireless string receiver - which will be greyed out because there's no transmitter yet.
If you put a string and string transmitter in your harmonics module, that will transmit a prefix to the preset names of all the knobs inside the module.
Then you just name all of the knobs in one of the modules - duplicate as many modules as you need, and you only need to edit the prefix string for each module to make all the names unique..

[lesobrod]

Thank you Trog. I see now. Operations with Strings is very interesting area of SM.
SM need regular expression mechanism, don't you think so?

[trogluddite]

SM need regular expression mechanism, don't you think so?

Like[ThisIdea] = ( Algorithmic * Music ) ^ ( Pemutations[Endless} - ( SameOld[LFOWaveshapes] * YetAnother[MoogClone] ) )

[lesobrod]

NextThought = 1- 2 * PrevThought * SomeoneThought
Trog, you read my mind across the land.
Well topic is closed but I still wonder - how appear values of controls in empty Preset programs?
They not just set to zero.

[trogluddite]

The default value for when
the number of presets is
increased

Now, if you try this with a completely new 'Preset Parameter' primitive from the toolbox, that's exactly what it does.
But, the bitmap knobs in the toolbox don't do this - they seem to have a 'memory' of some previous settings from when they were created. Tried it with some other controls - the 'Sliders' also seems to contain 'legacy' values, but the 'Readout Knob' works as it should.
What's interesting is that the controls that have a 'long memory' all contain exactly the same sequence of values - so I guess they are all modifications of one stock design.

I did some more experiments...

- Removed the 'Preset Parameter' primitive from a stock knob and replaced it with a fresh, new one from the toolbox - now it works as it should - added presets get the value at the default input.
- Dropped it into the toolbox. Reset the Manager to 1 preset. Put it back in the schematic. Increasing the number of presets now 'reveals' any preset values that were stored before it was dropped into the toolbox.
- Back to 1 preset, replaced the primitive again, into the toolbox (before adding more presets) - now works OK when dropped from the toolbox, new presets get the default value again (no memory effect)....

So, any time you drop a module into your toolbox that has presets, the preset values go into the toolbox with it - and will be 'revealed' when you use the module again. The default value is ignored until you add more presets than the control was 'saved' with. And it seems that OutSim must have done this with a lot of the stock toolbox controls (presumably just dragged in from the example synth etc.)

It may be worth re-making the controls with a fresh primitive, set to zero, to avoid surprises when adding new presets (zero so that output volume=0, so no blown speakers/eardrums when selecting an 'undefined' preset).
But really, I think it's nice to create a full bank of presets anyway, to be the defaults when a new user first loads your plugin - so really it's not much of problem IMHO, once you know what's going on!

[tor]

I am having a strange issue here. I am having a preset manager with just two presets. A & B. Both cubase and reaper just will not remember the the knobs position on the active preset when i save and reopen the project. All buttons reappear in the right state for both presets but those !"#¤%!%!% knobs reappear in default state on the last used preset after I open the project in the daws but for the inactive preset all parameters is remembered as it was set in the previous session.

Anyone having an idea here?

I have tried to replace all Preset Parameter prims and the Preset Manager prim with no luck

[Mo]

Anyone having an idea here?

Remove the RedrawLimiter module in the knob preset module.

[tor]

Thanks but I have no redraw limiter there now. Used to have one, but that was not the cause I realized. But also in all my other plugs there is a float changed module after the Preset Parameter prim and they work just perfect.

Edit:
Maybe this will do the trick
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtTUsOKjWyQ